1961 Hawaii Department of Health Registrar Identified! – Updated!

© WTPOTUS 2011

Extra, extra, read all about it! 


Our Hats Are Off…to


an EXTRAORDINARY crack researcher/commenter at WTPOTUS who has solved the riddle and discovered the identity of the registrar who allegedly signed Barack Hussein Obama II’s “long-form birth certificate.”

The reveal:

An entry in the 1961/62 Polk directory reads:

LEE Verna K L Mrs. clk State Dept of Health r1228 a 16th av


There you have it, boys and girls.   Mrs. Verna K. L. Lee,  and NOT  Mr. Ukulele!

It remains for computer experts to explain why on the birth certificates she allegedly signed (those we know about–Obama, an anonymous male born May 1959, and Edith Coats, born June 1962) her first initial looks more like a U than a V.  Or why she signed her name with initials instead of her full name.

Signature of Verna K. L. Lee on Obama’s White House Release of the Birth Certificate April 27, 2011


Signature of Verna Lee on Anonymous Male’s Birth Certificate dated April 14, 1960


A BIG tip of the hat to the extraordinary researcher who tracked down this information!

UPDATE:  Copy of the Polk’s Directory Page                   

    Click to enlarge images.

Polk’s 1961 Directory, Page 790

Verna K. L. Lee



166 responses to “1961 Hawaii Department of Health Registrar Identified! – Updated!

  1. Gee, those two signatures look enough alike to be (cough) exact copies! Except for the missing top of the V on Edith’s version.

  2. I remember there being one more B.C. with her signature circulating somewhere…maybe on one of the WND articles? I’ll try to find it.

    • SEO, you’re right and your comment tipped me to an error in the post. The darker looking BC belongs to an anonymous male. Iirc, WND did post that image. I’m in the process of finding Edith’s BC and copying the signature. Then I’ll update this post. Sorry, readers!

      • Yes! That’s the one!

        • Yeah. Sorry I screwed it up. I remember we had these images long ago, but I mislabeled them in our library. If anybody knows of others, please let us know. At this point, I can now say that all three signatures look oddly alike. I doubt she used a signature stamp, but anything’s possible.

  3. Thanks, SEO. I sort of thought there were other examples, but didn’t have them at hand. Anybody with information about Verna, please weigh in.

  4. Yes, WTPOTUS and Krewe, doing the job the lamestream won’t, since August 2009. (And before, elsewhere.)

  5. Is it somewhat bizarre that the health director on that anonymous male’s BC is given as Richard K. C. LEE?

    • I think maybe Lee is a very common name in Hawaii

    • Is it Richard, Pichard or Prchard? That first letter sure resembles a P.

      • Richard K.C. Lee , way back in 1945 helped organize the HI Territorial Health Dept. the first meeting of the Hawaii Public Health Association April 1945 . He was a health officer on research and planning with the American Public Health Association . Leo Bernstein was Deputy Director for the Hawai Public Health Association . The American Assoociation included the Asian Pacific regions. A woman with Red Cross named Myrtle Payne was also a member of Hawaii’s territorial Public Health Assoc. I will put more of this here tomorrow, as I am falling asleep. They both served in some capacity in 1960 AND 1961 , basically from the beginning in 1945.

        • I found Richard K C. Lee and Leo Bernstein and many others and there titles in a 1961 health Journal again. Now if I could find where I put it (par for me lately,as I am trying not to save so much).These two have been directors or deputy directors in 1960 an 1961, but the info was a little confusing because they served in several capacities on the HPHA(Hi.public health assoc. and the APHA (american public health association )both and as the territoriy’s public health administrative and the Hawaii department of Health. They served in research areas as well. The Myrtle Payne name was interesting,serving on the HPHA way back as well as in some way with the Red Cross blood bank when, after the war it was beginning its programs working with the civilian population. In this same Journal Vol. I found many many names in a list associated the the formum held in 1945 for the APHA and one that stood out was UIChI Lee associated with nursing and something to do with Kuakini hospital. I found twice a Uichi Kanayama who was a staff member at the Kuakini hospital . This was a Japanese built hospital in the 1800’s. In searching for the Uichi Knayama person it’s so funny, I found him in an article in Frank Marshal Davis’s Hon.Record. The paper was all about Unions and Communism. This was a 1948or 49 newspaper and blacklists in Hawaii were just getting cranked up. Secretary Tom Clark was and the senate were in the process of passing a bill on subversive groups.
          Anyway, I am trying to connect The Uichi name I find a few but no proof who they are or where they exist now. The Uichi Lee name in that med. journal may have been a nursing student at the Kuakini hospital (there was one there at one time. So far no luck, but I think this person may be the name as a registrar on the ubiquitous birth certificates. He or she does not show up dead in SS index . Any body want to take a stab at finding this person ,the Kuakini nursing school or hospital would be a start. I am thinking possibly too, that the Lee name could be a last name and this person(if female) could now have a different last name (like Kanayama or any million last names) .Hope this helps again.

          • Basically, I think all this looking for the UKele name may be a waste. I think Uichi (I have found spelling for this name several ways for the same individual ) anyway is a legitimate name most probably Japanese and not that unusual a first name. This legitimate Uichi Lee may be alive ,but he or she is certainly unaware that her name has been tossed back and forth all over the internet, or they would have come forward by now. Most likely this person is very old and has no idea they have become so popular. I did find a U. C. Lee in woodside n.y., Ui K. Lee in New YOrk, Ule lee in N.Y. ,and one Uichi Lee with various Uichi type spellings in addresses in N.J. . Vital records say there are 462 birth records for Uichi Lee, and 279 death records.

          • alfy, who’s tossing Uichi Lee’s name all over the Internet? We’re not talking about anybody named Uichi Lee. The person in question is Verna K. L. Lee, proved by the page from the city directory posted in the update above. There’s actually NO person with the surname Lee whose first name began with a U in the ’61-’62 directory. Obviously, the only person who fits the signature on that LFCOLB is Mrs. Verna K. L. Lee, a CLERK at the very HDOH in question.

            Now, unfortunately, Richard and James Lee don’t appear on that page. If we’re lucky, the extraordinary researcher may have obtained more pages of Lees, but we won’t know for sure until said researcher let’s Bridgette know via the usual method. Perhaps the source can supply that information? It might serve us well to know where, for example, those two men lived in 1961.

        • I misspoke saying Uichi all over the internet I meant the UKelele name. Verna might be the signer, but it’s here where someone said, they didn’t feel Verna, the school teacher was the registrar. I am saying that Uichi fits better and I have found that name a bunch, and whether it Vicke Vic Victoria or Uicki Uichi no one knows. tried to cover the bases. Just because Verna’s name is in the directory doesn’t mean much. Japanese names ,just like African , and just like we’ve seen, the Indonesian ones. YOUR RESEARCHER may not find a UiCKi or UIche Lee, because they aren’t listed that way or they could be listed with another family members last name. It’s sort of ironic I find Richard C Lee MD. and Leo Bernstein with UICHI Lee and UIchi Kanayama associated with that Kuakini hospital and then looking them up with that hospital I find Alfred Edward Minvielle Jr. studying there. Remember, his name was on Lolo Sotoro’s tax papers. Anyway , I did see by 1956 there were FOUR registrars there. You are the one who asked that question. Now whether some more were added by 1961 , haven’t found anything, but the med journal ,general director mr. Bernstein said there were four. You asked about Richard Lee yourself so I found what I could. I’ll not bother on it anymore.

          • In my experience, doctors are often married to nurses, so Uichi may be Richard’s wife. Or not. I don’t know how more certain we can be that V. K. L. Lee, clerk at the HDOH in 1961, is the person who is purported to have signed that LFCOLB. The initials match. The employment matches. The date matches. There’s nobody whose first name begins with U. The others with a first name beginning with V have different occupations.

            We know that Richard C. Lee MD was associated with Eleanor Nordyke and thus the East/West Center. Bernstein associated with that Lee. Yes, Lolo worked for Minvielle, doing something. But Lolo is also associated with the East/West center, the NEXUS for so much associated with Obama and his “mother”.

            There were four registrars before statehood, if I remember the article you cited correctly. This may be because before statehood, there were multiple governing bodies that issued birth certificates.

            People didn’t say Verna the teacher was the signer, people found that other Verna, a teacher, in the people searches, so it became obvious there was more than one Verna Lee. But now, seeing the city directory, we know there were two, and different individuals. One worked at the Health Dept., one was a teacher.

            As for Ukulele Lee. It may still be a “joke” played by the person who may have forged (probably did forge) that LFCOLB. It’s easy enough to change a cursive V to what looks like a cursive U. Creating the funny little inside joke, like I.B. Aphorgerie. Remember him? Since we have only three examples of Verna’s signature and since we can’t be SURE that any of them are legitimate, then they all may be copied and pasted from the same place. We don’t know for sure that Verna signed ANY birth certificates. If she did, she may have signed her name Verna K. L. Lee and somebody cut out the “erna”, leaving the V looking like a U, to create the little inside joke which is so typical of these arrested-development obots.

            WND published the copy from an anonymous male. We must take them at their word, but like any other anonymous source, with a grain of salt. Edith Coats’s bc was posted on the Web, by whom, I don’t know. Hers APPEARS to be legitimate. None of the red flags showing photoshopping, as with Obama’s. The Nordykes? They LOOK real, but are they? Is Eleanor, associated with the East/West center, a trusted source? What do we have? Digital images with no provenance.

            We ask questions and try to find answers. We try to focus. Yes, I did ask about Richard Lee, because it struck me that his name was the same as the registrar’s. I asked whether it’s possible that he and Verna were related. Makes sense in an insular (pun intended) place like Hawaii where, as in most state governments, nepotism is a way of life.

          • http://www.intelius.com/results.php?ReportType=1&searchform=name&qf=Uic&qn=Lee Notice number 3 and 4 and the various spellings. Id say at least there is a possibility. This was just with one quick try. And yes I know Ukelele is a joke, I may appear to be dumb as a conch as you graciously imply sometimes when research doesn’t fit your assumptions but I have found various vicks and people whose name does start with U . I figure even if it was a forged doc. they’ve used a name that existed .

          • alfy, I am implying nothing. I said what I mean and that’s all I mean. I don’t think you are “dumb as a conch” nor have I ever said so or meant to imply it. Nor do I throw away evidence that doesn’t fit my assumptions, without due consideration.

            I happen to agree with you that it’s likely they’d use a real name. I also believe they likely chose Verna K. L. Lee and made the joke by making her first initial look like a U. Perhaps for several reasons. To make a joke, to ridicule us, and also to throw people off the track, so nobody would find the real person and ask her if she perhaps used to sign BC’s at the HDOH. On the other hand, she may be for real and did sign birth certificates, and they just copied her signature from someone else’s birth certificate (maybe changing that V to a U, for effect). Of course, that scenario means that the Coats and the other BC are bogus, too.

            Sometimes, when I comment, I may state things that you already know and which are obvious to you, in order to bring up to date any new readers who may be unaware of the long history of our discussions here on this blog. There are some who believe that this information about Verna K. L. Lee lends authenticity to the LFCOLB. I don’t think it does. If we intended to throw out evidence that didn’t fit our assumptions, then we wouldn’t have publicized this finding in the first place.

            In addition, when people are writing instead of talking in person, things are often misunderstood because there’s no tone of voice or body language to lend meaning to the communication.

  6. so what does it mean?
    Is he legit,
    not installed by bilderberg / illuminati?

    Just a decent guy?

    I liked this today


    with thanks to Debby Harry

  7. How the heck often did they change health directors in Hawaii?

    The anonymous male’s has Richard K. C. Lee in 1960. Sounds like perhaps a little nepotism going on?

    Nordykes’ BC’s, copies produced in May 1966, have Leo Bernstein, M.D.

    Obama’s is recent, so not relevant.

    The Coats BC didn’t include the certification naming the Health Director.

    • Richard K.C. Lee, and mrs. Eleanor Nordyke, and all her work. I’m glad you guys are back on the subject of these people. I knew I’d seen Richard Lee in my scavenger hunts but couldn’t remember where. There is just something so suspicious to me that it is Mrs. Nordyke that just so happens to have birth certificates so near to the birth of “Barky Baby” and then all the rest of her interesting affiliations. She’s one person I’d say has an “IN” with every department of records, then of course her relationship with East West Center. Her husband also wrote some books. Then of course, I find Jonathan David Boyne (who has other various aliases) , who says he is a library scientist with the library at Hawaii University and who uses Mrs. Nordykes address . Mrs. Nordyke (of course this is just speculation),I would think is quite well known in all the halls of archives,i.e. birth records ,maybe even privy to private records of some individuals. I would expect that she and Richard Lee could do about anything they wanted or needed to in them there halls of the H department of Health,wouldn’t you?

  8. This won’t load…but check the names

    The Chinese in Hawai’i: A Historical and Demographic Perspective **

    ELEANOR C. NORDYKE and RICHARD K. C. LEE The Chinese in Hawai’i: A Historical and Demographic Perspective INTRODUCTION DURING THE PAST 200 YEARS, since Hawai’i was opened to the …

    https://evols.library.manoa.hawaii.edu/ bitstream/ handle/ 10524/ 318/ JL23224.pdf?sequence=2 –

    Hawai‘i Medical Journal



  9. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2712234/posts

    Go to post #6, Edith Coats birth certificate. Did you guys needs that?

  10. h/t extraordinary researcher: Verna’s husband’s name appears to be James F. L. Lee, according to the Hawaii Board of Conveyances.

  11. Good work thanks….but…..

    Why do you seem to think that a ‘computer expert’ would be able to explain the reasons why a woman that he doesn’t know chose in 1961 to sign the letter V in a certain style in her signature and/or why she preferred to use her initials instead of her full names?

    Would you expect a computer expert to be able to explain why Dr David Sinclair signed his name in such a way that the ‘v’ resembled an ‘r’ or to explain why Dr Richard Noda signed his name in such a way that the second ‘r’ resembles an ‘i’?

    • Why ask why, Judge Mental? Good question. Maybe because computer experts of various sorts have weighed in on the “reality” of this Obama LFCOLB from the beginning. Now, you might argue that with two other examples of Mrs. Lee’s signature, what’s the problem? But we’ve seen too many instances of false leads, red herrings, dirty tricks, smoke and mirrors. I’d like an expert to tell us the probability that one person would sign her name so exactly on three different documents. Is it cut and pasted from one place to another? Elsewhere on our blog, where this topic was discussed, commenters stated that there is a correct “form” for official signatures, meaning that a registrar should sign her full name. Why does that V look so like a U? Was it tampered with on all examples? Yes, you’re correct. Maybe Mrs. Lee habitually formed her handwritten V’s to look more like U’s. Possible. Computer experts who deal with digital images, which these are, might have other explanations.

      Here’s a good example of the sort of thing we’ve dealt with over the past few years. This photo has been on the Web for several years. It comes from Mark Okoth Obama Ndesandjo’s website. For several years, this is how it appeared:

      The above photo was obviously photoshopped. Notice the lips on the child on the right left. WHY?

      Here’s the current version from the same source: Mark’s website:

      Now these could be two shots taken withing minutes of each other, but why does the boy on the left now have lips? This is what we deal with when all we have for “evidence” are unprovenanced digital images.

      • Good grief is that second photo a gem. It looks like they removed his head and replaced it again.. only sideways! Such amateur work.

        • Words fail, don’t they? I forgot the link to Mark’s webpage. http://markobamandesandjo.com/home.html

          • And look at Mark’s face. How changed it is, too. The hairline! What became of the sharp widow’s peak? In a way, it somewhat explains the odd hair on the left side (his left) of the boy on the left. See how Mark’s head was resting against it, until for some reason they moved Mark’s head? What a dour little boy he was in that first picture. He looks so much happier in the second. Remember the supposed photo of David Opiyo as an older boy? Remember how similarly they photoshopped his upper lip, to make it conform with the bizarre lips on the first photo of the two boys?

            I haven’t a clue why that text is across the photo. Found it in our library.

          • miri, how do I send you a picture from a file of mine without showing identity. I tried opening it in edit and copied it, but couldn’t paste it here. What else do I do?

          • alfy, if you have a place on the Web where you store photos, you can send us a link in the contact us box and we can capture it from there, so long as for the moment you allow public access to it. You can put it by itself in a folder, like at Flicker, and make that folder public. Then, once we got the photo, you can delete that folder. I know, it’s complicated. Can you attach it in an email? If you’re in touch with any of our researchers, send it to them and they perhaps can get it to one of us.

          • The scarf or whatever is around his neck is only there because they couldn’t get the coloring right when they added the head to the body. It still doesn’t hide the difference in coloring of the face compared with the neck. The face has yellow tones while the neck has red tones. Another fake photo.

  12. GREAT investigating!
    Ancestry.com shows that Verna K. Lee lived at 1229 16th Ave in 1987 and 1993………….

    U.S. Public Records Index, Volume 1 U.S. Public Records Index, Volume 1
    Name: Verna K Lee
    Address: 1228 16th Ave Apt A, Honolulu, HI, 96816-4276 (1993)
    [1228 16th Ave, Honolulu, HI, 96816-4276 (1987)]
    [1228 A Av A, Honolulu, HI, 96818 (1993)]

    Public records indicate she may still be alive.

    We all are aware that this discovery is NOT evidence that the recent Obama BC posted at the White House web site is valid.

    • http://obits.staradvertiser.com/2010/10/15/ This would be your Verna Lee. Her short obituary is here. Died Oct. 3, 2010.

      • That Verna is Verna C. Lee, a teacher. Not sure it’s the same Verna, but worth noting.

      • Alfy, I already debunked Verna C. Lee on the other thread. It was before you started talking about Verna being Veronica or something like that. .

        • Yeah, it was Bridgette who said I already debunked Verna c. Lee and now I see you said Verna is listed right above HDOH clerk. Hmmm.. either at this point is OK by me, the point is the name is on a probable forgery….right? And Mrs. Ukelel hasn’t stepped forwar to claim her name to fame , so I’ll let the researchers do the rest and won’t make any more pitches for Uichi . Everybody Happy?

      • Note that Verna Lee the teacher appears on the directory image, right above the HDOH clerk, Verna K. L. Lee.

        Mrs. Toshiko Lee, nurse at Kapiolani Maternity. Interesting. 🙂

        Sunny Lee’s barbecue sauce? Yum.

  13. Amazing that she still has the same address (or did in 1993). Thanks, Jonah. Yes, we ARE all aware that this is NOT evidence the record is real. That’s why I leave it to the computer experts to expose the lie–that Mrs. Lee signed that LFCOLB. It’s likely that if other signatures were copied and pasted, this one was, too.

  14. According to ancestry.com, James F Lee lived at 1228 16th Ave as recent as 2002.

    U.S. Phone and Address Directories, 1993-2002 U.S. Phone and Address Directories, 1993-2002
    Name: James F Lee
    Address:1228 16Th Ave
    City: Honolulu
    State: Hawaii

    Zip Code: 96816-4215
    Phone Number: XXX-XXX-XXXX
    Residence Years: 1993 1998 1999 2000 2001 2002
    Source Citation: City: Honolulu; State: Hawaii; Year(s): 1993 1998 1999 2000 2001 2002.

  15. Are they feeling the noose? Criminals on the run?

    Hawaii Attorney General’s Office: “There Are No Attorneys Here” AND THE DIRECTOR OF HEALTH HAS “LEFT THE ISLAND!”

    (Jul. 18, 2011) — Dr. Orly Taitz, the attorney who has issued three subpoenas to the Hawaii Department of Health and Attorney General commanding that they make available for inspection the original birth certificate of Barack Hussein Obama II as part of her discovery in the Taitz v. Astrue lawsuit, told The Post & Email today that she and others who have contacted the attorney general’s office have been told by a secretary that “there are no attorneys here.”

    Taitz stated that she has also been told that Hawaii Department of Health Director Loretta J. Fuddy has “left the island.”


  16. To me the most likely explanation of those two photographs is indeed that two different shots taken at slightly different times. In one the child is simply pursing his lips by placing his upper teeth above his bottom lip, try it.

    Unless of course we are to conclude that the myriad of other obvious differences between the photos such as the position of the fingers on the hands, the positions of the rumpled folds of the shirts and pants, the chair visible in one and not the other etc etc, have all also been photoshopped to alter them.

    Of course people tend to write their signatures in a similar way each time (especially very simple and straightforward style signatures like Mrs Lee’s, it’s almost printing)…..isn’t the reliably repetitive nature of a signature the main point of the principle behind signatures being used? A computer expert can’t tell you anything more than a butcher about the likelihood of any particular person writing several signatures in a very similar way and you don’t need a computer expert to tell you that the examples of her signature are similar though far from identical, all you need is eyes.

      • Let me explain: First, we have comment rules. Fair debate. Ridicule of your debate opponent is typically an Alinsky tactic. I was duped by this commenter at first. Typically, I take people at face value. Once burned, twice shy, however. Judge Mental is not here to debate. Judge Mental is here to be an obot. And to waste our time whilst ridiculing us. For example, we do know the difference between pursing one’s lips or not. Do you know WHY and how we know the photo was modified in that exact place? While we may not be experts in handwriting analysis or computer graphics, we are more than familiar with photoshopping and its techniques. Are you? (Don’t bother to answer, Judge, you’re voted off the island.)

        Are you concerned that my call for a computer expert to analyze these three nearly exact signatures might lead somewhere? I never said “similar way”. I said they look enough alike to be exact copies. Try writing your name three times and see if the versions so closely match. Handwriting experts do not expect exact matches. They analyze similarities of design. The patterns. How people WILL reliably form the letters in the same way each time, not write the signature the same way every time, down to even the size of the letters. Pay especial attention to the Coats signature versus the Obama one.

    • A computer expert can look at the size and color of the pixels in a digitized signature and see if they are all the same. If part of a signature is pasted in, another part is written in with MS Paint or Photoshop and another part is pasted in from yet another document, the pixels in each may be of different sizes and of slightly different colors. The differences between the various parts of the signature would be unnoticeable to most people whilst a computer graphics expert could look at and analyze the signature and find all of its discrepancies.

  17. Bridgette….on or before the deadline of 8 August Ms ttaitz is going to get a letter from Hawaii that is almost identical to the one she got the last time. It will say that she has no entitlement in law to what she is requesting.

    There’s a good reason for that being how Hawaii are going to respond……that reason is, surprise surprise…. because she has no entitlement in law to what she is requesting. That alone is enough to doom what she is seeking to failure.

    As it happens, in addition to the above, in law it is crystal clear that the original bc is wholly irrelevant to the actual case in connection with which she is seeking access to it in the first place. That is because her case in Washington is solely about whether the documents and information she was supplied with in response to her SS related FOIA request in Washington met the requirements of the FOIA.

    Furthermore, it is almost inconceivable that there could ever be any ‘discovery’ stage in her FOIA case for all kinds of legal reasons….and there is definitely no question whatsoever of that FOIA case already being at a discovery stage right now. So any report of access to the bc being curently part of a discovery process for any case is absolute and utter nonsense. Such reporting/blogging is either deliberately disingenuous or arises out of ignorance.

    These above mistakes and misinterpretation and misunderstanding of aspects of the law are things that Ms Taitz has chosen, yet again, to find out the hard way as she is too up herself to understand her own shortcomings and her lack of adequate knowledge of the law. To paraphrase…”a woman’s not a fool if she doesn’t know, she’s only a fool if she doesn’t know that she doesn’t know”.

    Any competent lawyer or reasonably intelligent and objective layman would already know, or could easily ascertain, all of the above. I used to think that she couldn’t actually be this stupid and was simply acting it out in order to keep the paypal buttons for the gullible clicking. However it is becoming more and more obvious that she really is genuinely thick as a brick.

    I also predict that Ms Taitz will as usual eventually blame her failure in this particular case on more judiciary being “in on it” rather than face up to her incompetence and inability to understand the law.

    Feel free to come back and quote any of the content of this in order to berate me mercilessly if and when any of the above predictions fail to come to pass, I can take it.

    • Surrey you somehow know US law? How is that? Any competent obot who belongs to politijab or “reasonably intelligent” layman would already know or could easily ascertain that she’s a dork. Or he. Whatever the case. Or should I say a tosser? Oh, yes. You’ve hit all the obot talking points. Ms. Taitz, a woman, although a dentist as well as a lawyer, is “stupid”, a “dangerous nincompoop”, or a money-grubber, like former GOVERNOR Sarah Palin and accomplished lawyer, US Representative Michele Bachmann. The same tired old sexist talking points. When you can’t argue facts, attack the opponent personally.


    • Hey Judge Mental..take your crap back to Dr. Con’s or Fogbows and spew it. Those are your comrades! You won’t find anyone here that will be persuaded or influenced by your diatribe of given talking points that have no place where people are logical, can reason and analyze data. The hijacked democrats have have shown they only want followers, and the easiest to persuade are those such as are employed by ACORN, union thugs, felons, or other dregs of society.

      And if your group of Marxists, communists, progressives or whatever you are calling yourselves these days is so clairvoyant, we would want to know how you would know ahead of time what Orly will be receiving from the Hawaiian court on or before August 8. Is this another judge that is in the pocket of your leader Soros…for we know that BHO is just an illegitimate puppet and conman who is still an unknown usurper.

      If Orly weren’t important and worrisome your obot friends wouldn’t spend so much time berating her or anyone that stands up against the lies and fraud of BHO and his criminal cohorts. We will support those who have the courage to take on the fraud and corruption that the progressives have brought into our government.

      I wouldn’t waste anymore of my time on the likes of someone like you who is apparently educated enough to write well, but whose reasoning and ability to logically see the truth has been so decidedly warped. Are you trying to pass yourself off as a legitimate judge or lawyer? If so, your comments do not show themselves to equal the mental abilities of Orly (and in your line of thinking, that makes you insignificant!).

    • While your observations of Ms Taitz’s abilities are fodder for social circles, there is one important note about the law, it isn’t to be used to delay or deny even the least able the motion of the wheels of justice. The wheels came off the federal judiciary when Justice Carter tricked her to throw the case rather than hear it on merit as he had stated. In his explanation of his logic he clearly feared decapitating the government would follow a trial and based on this he viewed the separation of powers gave him grounds to dismiss. It was BS from on high. We all know what is going on and it’s called delay until the first black man finishes his term. How racist are congressional members and the courts? How certain are they that this man who has hired every ideological assailant of our supreme law has not in fact struck the death blow to our constitution already? Treason is the crime not document fraud or nepotism. The stakes are beyond looking at the technical aspects of law. Keep in mind the owners of that law are not required to pursue it in the courts but first by ballot then by force. The Declaration of Independence clearly states the proof required for this change is merely establishing utter despotism as the direction. When masses of people are denied redress and standing in courts, what is the definition if not despotism?


      • erric rice, very well put. did you say that or the article? I havn’t read your post site yet.havn’t had time yet.

  18. What’s the big secret?

    hmmmm, perhaps there is no father named on the birth record… perhaps there is no birth record… hmmmm.

    Show me; Don’t tell me.

  19. Judge Mental
    You are just simply …… WRONG

    • Indeed. Judge Mental is also banned. We don’t tolerate obots who come here with cut-and-pasted talking points to ridicule and disrupt instead of to add to the search for the TRUTH. Of course, they wouldn’t search for the TRUTH because they CAN’T HANDLE THE TRUTH.

      Here’s some truth that the Judge won’t appreciate, given how fond they are of their national health service:


      Kathleen Parker, alleged “independent” or “conservative” or whatever passes for their idea of “balance” in the lamestream media, piles onto Barry for LYING about his mother’s final illness. How he claimed she lay on her death bed fighting with the insurance company to pay for her MEDICAL TREATMENT, arguing that her condition wasn’t pre-existing. Of course, all a lie.

      Yet Parker, once more conservative, now less so when she’s paid by the lamestream to provide bogus “balance”, does still shy from the word.

      “It is too much to say that Obama told an intentionally tall tale to mislead the public. But it is also incorrect to say that he told a true story.”

      No, Kathleen, it’s not “too much.” In fact, it’s absolutely the truth. Tell it like it is! It’s not a “tall tale.” It’s a LIE.

      But she does tell it like it is, leading the horse to water, so to speak, even if she won’t SAY IT HERSELF. She points out later in the article that Barry himself was his mother’s point man on this issue (so should remember)!

      “Not only did he represent his mother’s interests at the time and, presumably, have legal notes and correspondence in his own files, but he knew he would use the anecdote to make his argument for health care reform. Surely, he might have expected that someone eventually would fact-check his account.”

      NOPE! Kathleen, don’t be ridiculous. If the past decade has taught you anything, it should have taught you that fact-checking Barry (first the rising star and now the first African-American POTUS) is the third rail of American media. And European and British, too, btw. Barry counts upon the FACT that NOBODY IN THE MEDIA WILL FACT-CHECK HIM OR HIS BOGUS ACCOUNTS. And, I might add, when any inconvenient truth does come out, the lamestream media fall all over themselves to help him prevaricate, obfuscate, and LIE in order to rationalize or explain it all away, which works for obots and anybody who’s not paying attention.

      Besides, it’s a good parable. Let’s not let the truth get in the way of Barry’s “brand”.

      • http://www.cnsnews.com/commentary/article/brent-bozell-obama-lies-about-his-mother

        Brent Bozell weighs in on the virtual media blackout of Barry’s lie about his mother.

        “On July 3, 1999, The New York Times exposed Al Gore for lying about his family in a national convention speech as vice president of the United States. In 1996, Gore had moved the Democrats to tears by claiming that when his sister Nancy died of cancer in 1984, he vowed then and there to oppose the tobacco industry. How courageous – and completely untrue.

        The Times found Gore campaigned in 1988 boasting of his tobacco-farming prowess. So he lied through his teeth. Network coverage from ABC, CBS, or NBC on this whopper, even as Gore prepared a presidential run? Zero.

        On July 13, 2011, this cycle repeated itself, when The New York Times reported on another national Democrat lying about a death in the family in his convention address, presidential debates, just about everywhere. That was Barack Obama in 2008 claiming his mother Ann Dunham died of cancer battling with insurance companies all the way through. Dramatic? Yes. But an utter lie. Network coverage of this new jaw-dropper on ABC, CBS, and NBC? Also zip, zilch, zero.

        How pathetic. This is the same set of networks that devote multiple heavy-breathing stories to “correcting” non-candidate Sarah Palin’s historical knowledge of Paul Revere, or Michele Bachmann’s location for the birthplace of John Wayne. But Obama lies about his mother – a shameless, pandering tug using his mother to get socialized health care, and they’re mute!

        In a story published on page 16, reporter Kevin Sack explained “The White House on Wednesday declined to challenge an account in a new book” that Obama “mischaracterized a central anecdote about his mother’s deathbed dispute with her insurance company.” The headline said the book “challenges” the Obama story, and in the story they used the word “mischaracterized.” It was a whole lot more than that.”

  20. I have a feeling I met Judge Mental once. Not too long ago.

  21. The Bill Ayressssssssss fairy tale should have been called:

    Convenient Dreams of Contriving A Father I Never Had.

    When will Ruth be called to the stand?
    …. the only living person — Duct Tape! Aisle 6. Duct Tape!

    shushie uppy!

  22. Was ‘Ukulele’ on a coffee break?

    • Abracabra!! Here it is…

    • I believe there were multiple “clerks” or local registrars who could sign birth certificates. This was one of the discrepancies we discussed before, when his LFCOLB first came out. He should have had the same local registrar as the Nordykes, since they were born the next day, in the same hospital.

      What’s that name? Beatrice L. Ygnacio? Hey, she signed her FULL first name! Hmmm. Wonder why?

      • on the Nordyke’s birth certificates where the registrars name is what is the stamped part? It looks like deputy to me. I can’t see some things that well. maybe this signature is that of a deputy registrar? Ithink its the Nirdykes that I saw it.

        • It does look as if it says “Deputy”, stamped next to Beatrice L. Ygnacio’s name. Deputy local registrar? She was filling in maybe?

  23. An explanation I have read is the reason Barrty and Nordykes have different local registrars may be that Barry was not born at Kop.(surprise!) If he was brought to the Dr. to have birth cert it was different hospital, thus a dif registrar in dif part of town.
    Then we wonder about Baby Virginia. She was not born at Kop, but I believe did unfortunately die there. If they used her BC # and her info……….????????

  24. Yes, we’ve heard that theory, too, Charlene. It makes sense, although it’s possible that more than one local registrar covered Honolulu, being the largest population center. Baby Virginia is certainly an interesting case. Indisputably born and died that same week, listed in the 5-year birth index, and yet the HDOH claims to have no birth certificate for her. And her number might logically fall right after the numbers for the Nordyke twins.

    • In 1955 That head guy of Dept. of health (the name on the right beside Richard Lee MD name ) explained all about the department and when they became up to date with the state. In 1908,as a territory, they met the standards for filing births, deaths, marriages,divorces.Hawaii and Massechusetts were and may still be, the only states that (forgive my slight understanding of this part)when filing a late certificate or changes) must be filed with two separate departments–with the dept. of health and with The Secretary of Health Office. When this was written in 1955 he explained all the important reasons for filing correctly , accurately , and for Census purposes was a big one and of course all proceedures that one would need a legitimate clear concise record uniform with all the states .In 1955 he explained that sometime prior there were separate government agents ,as many as 35 just for Ohau. Now it is the states responsibility and there are four registrars appointed and sworn in for Ohau.Also the forms are or can be changed every ten year intervals. The last change was in 1949 so that would make the next change on any forms 1959,however to meet the Census they had voted to change the forms starting 1956,so the next changes if any would be now in 1966. So , I would think there were four registrars . I also tells how hospitals report a birth, by the doctor or a nurse . If there is a question or descrepancy the department can call the hospital and request information from the hospital .Anyone can answere these questions at the hospital however it is the doctors resposibility as to the accuracy. If born at home or elsewhere a person or witness must report the birth within seven days of the birth to the department. Looks like otherwise they would have to file another form to request a verification of birth after this. I hope I have helped. I copied this from m a 1955 medical journal vol. ?.

      • Couldn’t finish….I hate writing here. Is it me or what am I doing that makes it impossible almost to edit or check anything I’ve written? I figure you all had seen that article in the journal or at least many researching the birth certs have because after this vol. another volume and page notes B’s birth in Aug 4, 1961 on the same site.

        • alfy, it’s not you. It’s WordPress. I have trouble with the comment box, too.

        • Are you using Internet Explorer?

          This works on my PC:

          Install Firefox.
          1 – The comment box expands as it fills.
          2 – If comments are typed into a text document, then copied & pasted to the comment box, clicking (left or right) outside the box causes the box to open.
          Mozilla Firefox:



        • alfy, Can you try to divide your comments into paragraphs so they will be easier to read? I find myself skipping over the last parts due to the “big block of print that wares out your eyes” effect. My new glasses don’t help even now when I am more used to them.

          • I’ll be glad to break it up. sometimes since this new reply box, I can’t move back or over . the cursor jump so I tend to run everything together. I am getting a little better with it(barely). I agree and my thoughts run together enough as it is. I’ll try. How about this.
            Now, could you tell me who I can email a picture to? Safely ?

  25. Judge Mental: Pants on fire. I wasn’t alluding to signature stamps? Au contraire. I point you to yesterday, 3:05 p.m. “I doubt she used a signature stamp, but anything’s possible.” A sane logical person would not mischaracterize what someone has said. We have open minds here. Try it sometime. Yes, our researcher did a most excellent job. Our researchers usually do. We’re looking for TRUTH. We consider all sides of the argument. Just like a jury. The preponderance of the evidence (what little exists and can be found, before being scrubbed or hidden away.) We must deal with the evidence at hand. You want to believe that somehow Mrs. Lee, absent a signature stamp, was able to reproduce her signature so very exactly on the three examples we have. It’s possible, but unlikely. What we need are more examples. And it certainly would help to have, as Obama had his lawyer promise in that waiver, the actual document available to us, the public. After all, that was his alleged purpose in getting the waiver. Wasn’t it?

  26. Thank you, “Angry American Patriotic Jew 1/2 Goy” We like you, 2! Lovely photo, too. 🙂

  27. This article has a lot of information. You may already know most of it, but I thought I would share just in case you don’t.


    • Miri found the claremont site and one writer she share with us was spot on. I see when you click on the first captians it goes to amazon for the book . That’s nice too ,. I went to the Firstbrook guys book on Obama and read the brief on it. So funny his story is that lore has it that Onyango tried to murder his first wife Akuma (what’s her name) . So Ms Sally Jacobs says she dies ,so Onyango marries his second wife,Obama’s stepgrandmother. But Barry’s book (which I checked out of the local library long ago,”Dreams of my Father”) says Akuma took off , wasn’t happy , left in the night. The children went without their mother.This of course is the sadder version. So who gets to come forward next and maybe tell us that Akuma or Hekuma or what ever her name is, is living in the states somewhere in Louisiana, or maybe took up with her grandchildren in Maryland and is working at an allnight convenience store of some Moslem brother, living on stolen foodstamps. Can’t wait for the next round of stories.

      • Tried to? Or did? Has she been seen again? Or did somebody publish a photo of her grieving over BHO Sr.’s casket? Seems I recall something like that. She looked amazingly young for her age.

    • Thanks for reminding us of that one. I hope I saved it in the links.

  28. Scan of the Polk’s Page now posted.

  29. Exclusive: Interviewee: Obama Born in Kenya, Birth Records are in the Possession of Kenyan Prime Minister

    (Jul. 19, 2011) — Recently The Post & Email was contacted by someone who stated that he was told by very reliable business contact within his company that they were provided information before the 2008 presidential election that Barack Hussein Obama II was born in Mombasa, Kenya. The interviewee stated that his coworkers were told by an assistant to an under-secretary within the Kenyan government that Obama’s birth record existed in Kenya, and that the information was not difficult at the time to obtain.

    The following is our interview with the individual:

    MRS. RONDEAU: Thank you for contacting us regarding the knowledge which you said you have that Obama II was definitely born in Mombasa, Kenya. How did you learn that information?

    INTERVIEWEE: Actually, it was prior to the presidential election when I had conversations with Atty. Philip Berg. He wanted to know if there was any way to find out if a certified copy of Obama’s Kenyan birth record could be obtained from any hospital in Kenya. We do a lot of business in that country and work very closely with the various ministries there as well as very high officials in the government, but the timing was such that the record had already been taken by Raila Odinga, the current prime minister of the country. I suppose if we had gone in there a month or so earlier, it might have still been possible for us to get it. It might still be possible to get it, but it would cost a lot of money and would be very, very difficult.

    MRS. RONDEAU: Have you looked at the alleged birth certificate that Mr. Lucas Smith has put out on the internet?

    INTERVIEWEE: Yes. I recall that Orly Taitz had submitted it to Judge David O. Carter in her lawsuit. That was totally bogus and obviously fraudulent because Kenya was a country that was under British rule for many years, and when Obama was born, information on his birth record would have been given in metric measurements: height, weight, etc. The document I have seen has it in inches and pounds, so it’s totally fraudulent.

    • 😮 !!!!

      Okay, so I’ve read the story at P&E and it occurs to me that if we accept these as truths:

      1. Barry WAS born in Kenya.

      2. Barry received a British/Kenyan birth certificate UPON BIRTH IN KENYA.

      3. Stanley Ann Dunham or his mother (whoever she may be), as reported in Barry’s own biography, did NOT have the documentation to PROVE that Barry was Barack Hussein Obama Senior’s SON, so Barry could not (and DID NOT) inherit anything from the estate.

      Then there can be only two conclusions:

      1. Barry’s father is NOT Barack Hussein Obama Senior, or

      2. Barry’s father IS Barack Hussein Obama Senior, but he was born illegitimate.

      In any case, if we accept that Barry WAS born IN Kenya, then he’s not eligible to be POTUS, no matter WHO his father was. Any argument to the contrary would mean that somebody would have to PROVE who his mother was, which looks less likely to be Stanley Ann Dunham.

      If he was born in Kenya, then it looks more and more plausible that he was born to a relative of BHO Sr.’s who named the “child” after him. Could a relative like Auntie Zeituni, BHO Sr.’s sister, have given birth to a son, illegitimately, given him up to Granny Sarah to be adopted out as an orphan, but named him [“my child,” her exact words, many times] after her beloved brother? Which is why he’s a II and NOT a junior?

      It makes perfect sense that Barry, during his unusual visit to Kenya to CAMPAIGN FOR his COUSIN Raila Odinga, might have arranged to have the important documents disappeared. Which is why he’s so confident that nothing will ever come to light. Unless somebody squeals.

      Barry resembles Zeituni more than any other member of that family, imho. That unusual pre-election trip to Kenya as well as the earlier one in the mid-90s, when he began his political career, are seen in a new light now.

    • All about Raila Odinga, Obama’s cousin, (Obama says they aren’t related…) who probably wants to get paid to release the birth certificate. How much aid has been sent to Kenya so far that is above and beyond prior years? Bribes and blackmail work well in 3rd world countries, and blackmail can be concealed in aid monies.

      Obama’s Kenya Ghosts
      Sunday, October 12, 2008

      About 50 parishioners were locked into the Assemblies of God church before it was set ablaze. They were mostly women and children. Those who tried to flee were hacked to death by machete-wielding members of a mob numbering 2,000.


    • Lucas Smith sent information rebutting the person’s information above stating that ” Kenya, as well as Great Britain, used the measurements of “pounds” and “yards” until the mid-to-late 1960s. His blog posting today contains a page from the “Colonial Reports – Annual” dated “1938″ which states that “The pound, yard and gallon, identical with those used in the United Kingdom, are the standard weights and measures of the Colony…”

      Kenya was a colony and a protectorate of the British Empire until its independence was declared in December 1963. He shows the citation for “The British Weights and Measures Act 1985, Chapter 72.” The United States uses what is known as the “Imperial Metric System,” which was reportedly “first defined in the British Weights and Measures Act of 1824. One source states that “In the 1970s, most British Commonwealth nations changed from the Imperial system of units to the metric system.” A chart here shows that Kenya and Uganda officially adopted the metric system in 1967 following Great Britain’s conversion in 1965.


  30. Oh, yes. All in a day’s work for commie thugs. Burn Christians? Check. Riot when you lose an election? Check. Threaten more violence if you don’t get to “share” power? Check. Be a sore, sore loser? Check. Corruption out the wazoo? Check.

    Sounds like kin to me.

  31. Off topic for this thread, but. . .Has anyone noticed that Stanley Ann Dunham’s signature on the purported SSN application is written PERFECTLY straight across? As in one could take a ruler and draw a perfectly straight line under it. Who writes such a perfectly straight signature when it is not resting on any line? How many sixteen year old girls would sign their name with such precise alignment?

    • Welcome, C.A. Holly. Good point. Perfectly straight across? Can’t remember if we’ve heard that exact argument but it’s worth thinking about. Yes, we’ve tried to compare her signatures on multiple different documents. The high school photo signed to “Max”, various versions in her passport file, among others. Seems we’ve seen a computer analysis that proves the script lines up exactly, meaning it had to have been pasted because nobody can write so exactly. One “expert” has commented here about Stanley Ann’s signatures: https://wtpotus.wordpress.com/2011/07/06/obamas-mama-had-a-fraudulent-social-security-number-too/comment-page-1/#comment-58697

      I really do believe I remember somebody else speaking about this, but can’t remember where. Anybody remember? Too many “experts” weighing in. We’re not experts, so we tend to go with the evidence of our own eyes. And what makes logical sense.

      • Speaking of that comment by Dr. P. (aka Dr. Ron, aka Polarik), do I dare play the name game and bring up that other name he mentioned there? Shirley LEE Applebee. There are several Shirley Lees on that Polk Directory page. Could Lee be a maiden name instead of a middle name? But I thought Shirley Applebee’s middle name was Jean, but now I don’t know where I heard that.

        Social Security Death Index: Shirley Dunham
        SS#: 539-38-1493
        Born: Nov 4 1941
        Died: Jan 1975
        SS# issued: Washington (1958)

        Wait, I remember now. Orly Taitz mentioned Shirley Jean Dunham Applebee. Or maybe it was Shirley Jean Applebee Dunham. Maybe Dr. Ron would care to elucidate?

        Speaking of SHIRLEY. Remember SHIRLEY Ann Dunham? https://wtpotus.wordpress.com/2011/02/01/shirley-we-hardly-knew-ye-open-thread/

      • maybe someone has one of those stylus pens that you can write and draw with on a mouse. People with graphics and art programs use them. Then after writing a signature on that they paste it into a word document , which lines the signature back up. Just guessing, but this way you could type all your document stuff, go back and handwrite stuff and then drop it into your document.

      • Compare it to her signature on her marriage certificate to Lolo…completely different! But if you can find a decent copy of SAD’s own bc: her signature on the SS app and the LFCOLB, look exactly like stanley ARMOUR dunham’s signature on his daughter’s BC.

        • SEO, you’ve given us a new assignment! I’ll try to put together a post with all the various signatures for comparison. Will take me a while, but I’ll work on it. Don’t think we’ve done that before.

  32. No Miri, before statehood they were already complying with the states to make their records synonomous with the states and befor that even they were good record keepers. If I can find that damn article again it would be nice. They have recorded records back to at least 1850s and had compiled much as a territory of the U.S. . There were four and before that ,between 1908 and I believe 1945 ,Bernstein said 35 different government entities that compiled records not all into one or two departments to make it more efficient. . The Census (as we see even now, with the indigenous Hawaiians) was very important to them . It gave them much research material for understanding the Hawaiian population dwindling. Because so much grief has come their way over this bc thing they don’t appear to look too competent, but I think that is not neccesarily the case. If you’ve ever been able to experience working in records departments one thing is predominant (just like librarians), most of the people there have an affinity or at least develop one for what they do and are quite efficient at it. THis just goes with the territory. Another thing is if someone or some people there are working deliberately to cover something up , eventually this will rear its ugly head. If someone had time to spend in their department ,say for research of anytype, eventually it would be recognizeable if and who was busy hiding or reworking or spending an unreasonable amount of time in a particular area. Of course if it is someone very trusted like say a sweet little ole lady just doing her many years of Hawaiian ancestry research, they might go unnoticed for a long time. Republican Gov. Lingle was also on the board at the East West Center.Then of course( jumping around a bit) there’s this guy who became associated with the East West Center as the comminications director ,not until 1970, but guess where this Unitarian Dude was prior to that in the 60’s. He was a Ford Foundation consultant prior to 1970 to the government of India and Led exchange Mission to the Soviet Union. Now you think it’s possible he had anything to do with getting Ann a job at the Embassy or that they ever knew each other. Haven’t looked into him at all,but I don’t know Ford, Soviet Union, EW Center???? He had also been an ambassador somewhere .

  33. Has anybody ever done a search for a birth certificate for Barry or Barack Dunham? Did he marry Michelle as Barry Sotero or Barack Obama?

    • http://ssdi.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/ssdi.cgi Heres a barry dunham ss search. I’ll see what else I find.By the way Oklahoma a Florida for me have had some suspicious ties as well and Indiana,sometimes Kansas and of Wa. State. Mark Ndesandjo’s Ndesandjo interprises was established and licensed out of winterpark florida, for example. And Oklahoma is where I find James Tate dunham and Marcus tate dunham with Stanley, madelyn and ann all listed as relatives. I don’t know how many times I have brought that up but I think I am the only one who thinks it is signifigant.

      • I see Barry dunham didn’t post. you get just the blank page to fill in but go there with what I posted and have at it for all the names and associated names you can think of. Don’t fill out the specifics or you wont get anywhere. Just try last name, first name. You can try just a last name and a state to narrow down your search. if you look up someone just with a last name and get 500 people with that name, then get more specific. Have fun . there were two Barry dunhams. You will notice (v) or (p) sometimes which means proof or verification. Verification is not 100% that this person is dead. Depends on alot of criterea which you would not find here. Proof is a legal signed death certificate. These days even that (I am thinking of Madelyn Dunham) can be signed someone claiming to verify death that could be a scam. It’s tricky, but Hey, the Weather underground falsified and faked 100s , maybe thousands of ss# ,drivers licenses, birthcertificates ,passports, you name it, it can be done.

      • Alfy, Where do you find James Tate Dunham and Marcus Tate Dunham with Stanley, Madelyn and Ann in Oklahoma? I have ran several searches and I am not finding it. Can you give us a link or post the information?

        • http://www.intelius.com/results.php?ReportType=1&searchform=name&qf=Brooks&qn=Dunham&qs=HI
          sometimes these don’t paste. It will be blank. Right now this is all I find. But you really must understand. These people are for sure the same people that when long ago ,I did reverse address lookup at madelyns apartment. Brooks dunham was there with madeyly, as was a James Pate tate (I have found his name changed a bunch from james Patrick dunham to james tate , the P changes alot but he’s with the same people. Stanley ann dunham , stanley armour dunham, Marcus dunham tate ,Marcus P. Tate, and Brooks. sometimes I find a Jill Dunham with them and a patricia Dunham. They have been at two addresses for madelyn. That is more than one apartment number in her building.

          When I first found them at her apartment, that is when I could find them all listed together in overland park, Ok., sometimes in kansas, and also in Missouri. I saved them as favorites many times and they would disappear when I would check back to them, so I would search around till I would find them again in still the most popular names.

          The ann dunham name sometimes would be shirley ann, mary ann, patricia ann but they were grouped with Marcus and James p. Tate or James t or p. Dunahm. This is very important I feel, because as far as anyone knew Mrs. Madelyn lived alone, but I clearly found them at her address. I also found a Cynthia Gilligan related there once. Evidently someone else did not long after she died because I read ” who is Cynthia on a Blog way back then.”

          I would like to find one of them as a real live person. There was a young Marcus Dunham that Free Republic reported on that had to do with Obama’s campaign. He was a student at Furman(sp) college in Greenville S.C. that Free Republic says he and another student there got into some sort of trouble in Ohio over something to do with voter registration. I did find him and read from one of Marcus’s articles about he an the other student (very sweetly) remarking about their experience helping the O. campaign.

          I have often felt that Madelyn’s apartment was nothing more than a headquarters for something and perhaps they use even more than one apartment. I can’t recall for sure but I am pretty sure I found Madelyn in apt.100 or 1001, but I also could find her at another #. I am sure by now this stuff is gone just like now it’s harder to find any of them together. I wouldn’t have brought this up again, except I had just found them again and saved it to my favorites. Its gone. There ‘s got to be some more sites where it isn’t scrubbed. I really think someone is using names in various ways either for voter fraud or to send money to an account. I wish I knew.

        • http://www.intelius.com/results.php?trackit=65&ReportType=1&qc=Honolulu&qf=M&qn=Dunham&qs=HI&qz=96826&

          I am trying to post Madelyn Dunham for Kathy. Now here she is listed with Stanley, and stanley Ann, and only one of the people I mention, Marcus Tate. Do you see that everybody. Now Brooks and James P. Tate is not here this time but I’ll keep looking. But you see I am not making this up. I have no idea if this Marcus Tate (who I also found with James and Madelyn and Ann in Kansas and Oklahoma before) would be kin to the Jill Tate Higgins, which is the person whose fancy condo he stayed at in Hawaii before the election. I have found a Jill listed with them before but that’s too complicated to explain.

          Also Madelyn’s address is listed on Wickipedia as 1617 Beretania S. Apt. 100. That is what most info says, but this is not the apt. # I found her in. She was in apt.# 1008. I have also found her to be living at 101 and 1001. Why would that be? Anybody want to guess?

          • M L Dunham, age 88

            Name/Aliases M L Dunham
            Madelyn Lee Dunham
            Has lived in Honolulu, HI
            Punahou, HI
            Phone Address
            Related to
            Stanley A Dunham
            Stanley Ann Dunham
            Marcus T Dunham

    • I think Ladys Forest was getting lists of names from Hawaii’s Index files to see if different names would show up. She did that as well as Miss Tickley and Leo. They were asking for specific names and were getting stonewalled. Ladys Forest published several pages that she was sent or that someone photocopied for her.

      She would be able to answer your question. She may check in and let us know.

      Good question as to what name he used when he married Michelle. Good grief, they may not be really married if he used a fraudulent name..and their kids would be illegitimate! Now that is a scandal for Globe!

      (He started using the BHO name when he applied for his fake/forged Selective Service card!)

      • They want us to believe he started using the BHO name when “he” registered with Selective Service. But apparently he didn’t and they forged the card, allegedly. My guess, though, is that when he went to Pahhhhhkeeestahhhhhhhhn in 1981, he was using a Muslim name. Either BHO or Soebarkah or Soetoro. By the 90’s, at Harvard, we know he used Barack Obama because of the news articles about him. He won’t release Occidental or Columbia records and the reason may be that while there, he WASN’T Barack OBAMA. So much disinformation, which is why we need contemporaneous proof, which may have already gone poof!

  34. I’m sure that somebody has asked the HDOH for index data, at the very least, for Barry Dunham or Barack Dunham. Good question about under what name he married Michelle. It’s said that he started using his current name in the early 80s. At Harvard, he was known as Barack Obama, so I assume that’s the name he used when he married. Whether that’s his LEGAL name is anyone’s guess. Used to be that a person could legally change his name by simply using it for X number of years. I don’t know if that is true anymore.

    • funny you should mention that Miri. I had wanted to say something about nicknames ,legal names ,and AKA names. When getting criteria for birth and death certificates it is required that a persons legal name be on that document. Also known as names are stated in a different place and way. If a persons name is Robert and they are known as Bob that is not what I mean. If a persons name is Robert and they go by Wolfy but that is not there legal name it is stated in parenthesis . A person can use a name for so long and can use it say even on his checks because he is recognized by that name, but that is not the same as a legal name change. In a way what you said is half way correct but there is a distinction.

      For matters of an estate , for matters of geneology, and all sorts of other health statistic gathering , and for collecting on leins , taxes ect. states try to make clear what your legal name is. Any one can legally change their name (almost anyone). You may go by a nickname until it has become your name for all sorts of conceivable purposes, or you can change your name because you woke up one day and decided to become someone else on a whim, and either way it is legal, but it is not actually legal until the court says it is, so that upon your death or social security purposes ect. you get what ‘s coming to you.

      Typically you go in and might say I have been using this name for years and woud like it to be so and so, and that’s all there is to it,depending on the state and how you want to change it can be more involved. The court must decide you are not trying to hide your identity, that you are not avoiding something by changing your name and other things such as this . You may need a witness.
      My mother in law had a weird first name. She never liked it. She had a nickname from the time she was a child that she used throughout her life. When someone called her by her real name no one knew who in the heck they were talking about. She signed her checks with this name in the casual sense, but used her legal name with her nickname in perenthesis on important papers or checks. Her license plate was her nickname, but her license had her real name with nickname in perenthesis. Social Security Index files read this way also. Death indexes should and are the same. That way when one dies they are identified from birth to death as the same person.When you legally have a name changed the states try to show it was changed from your birth record name so again you are kept in the legal perameters of your identity.
      I am sort of dwelling on this because it hit me the other day when I looked up Obama Buckner who was born as I believe George Henry Buckner (he says) and after meeting a wise spiritual man in Hawaii he began using the mans name Obama. So how is it that this man who was born in Indiana and was issued his social security number in Indianna I would assume prior to ever meeting this Obama man, dies in 2001 as Obama Buckner, with no other names (his old George or Henry name). I find that rather strange. So legally was he Obama Buckner? I doubt it ,in his obituary it is said it was a nickname. The Obama name is not in perenthesis and his other names are not there at all . I think this is important. I have looked to see if I can find him as George Henry Buckner . There is something wrong here.
      A weird though occurred to me as I thought about it. Obama Buckner, I had found early on way before elections. Now I thought what if it is the other way around as Buckner says it. That instead Obama is using his name. Of course Obama Buckner up and dies just like everyone else in the life and times of Obama.

  35. Its been a long time since I looked at stanley annes certificate she got issued from kansas. Was that a soc. sec. application or a birth certificate she got in 1959. I am asking so I can clear up something I had noticed from the ss death index.

  36. Hi, I like to read the various sites on this topic but don’t really post. However. I posted on ORYR the significance of finding the name in response to some other comments and it wasn’t posted. Something strange seems to be happening over there.

    So, here’s what I said: we need to know which field office Verna worked in. I remember reading somewhere that, in 1961,Hawaii had numerous field offices which would collect the birth certificates, then send them to the central office where they would be organized by geographic location (starting with most remote)and date and then stamped with the BC number. So,one field office’s stack would be arranged by date, place of birth (i.e. hospital, home birth, foreign birth registration), then the next field office, and so on. This was done because only odd number BC’s were counted for the Census information and they didn’t want regional (rural/city) birth data to be skewed. Anyway, this would account for birth’s on the same day being out of sequence as far as numbers go (Nordykes)- they were born in different regions.

    • Extremely excellent point, hayden. Welcome, btw. You are so correct. Just because Verna lived in Honolulu, doesn’t mean she worked there. Actually, just because we see her name on digital images and that she’s listed as a “clerk” in the Polk directory, doesn’t mean that she signed any birth certificates. But it’s very worthwhile to discover exactly who she is and what she did and where.

    • Hi Hayden,
      I am familiar with posting difficulties at ORYR and of late have experienced same. I am not qualified to say one way or the other, but I wonder at times if ORYR hasn’t been hacked or otherwise tampered with by obots.

      Thank you for your expeditious reply re the SAD signature on her purported SSN application. Signatures, as is known, are like snowflakes with no two exactly alike. Though no expert, I would think a bit-for-bit match would be proof positive of cutting and pasting.

      Keep up the great work. You’ve certainly some great sleuths here.

      • Seems as if someone, somewhere HAS done that bit for bit matching, but I can’t remember where I saw that. We do have a lurking obot who, unlike you, seems to believe that a person CAN somehow write her signature the same way over and over. Perhaps it’s possible, but unlikely. I doubt that signature stamps were used, but it’s possible. They do seem to use Onaka’s signature stamp, which to me seems ridiculous. How does a stamp authenticate anything? Can you stamp a contract? Can your doctor stamp a prescription? Anybody can have a stamp made up. EVEN one that says “TXE” instead of “THE”. 🙂

        We’re not sleuths. We’re just a group of concerned, independent citizens who came together over the past few years because we’re appalled at what’s becoming of our beloved country and especially at the amorality of the people who support Obama. We’re not Donald Trump. We can’t hire private investigators. All we can do is use our noodles and search for information in PUBLIC records, while the still exist, before they’re disappeared by the Ministry of Truth.

      • For what it’s worth, I checked ORYR yesterday and saw some commentary about the site being deluged with obot comments, so they had to go into moderation. Apparently, they didn’t moderate before. I don’t frequent there but they do pick up some of our posts, so I check there when that happens. Maybe that’s why you’re not seeing your comments in a timely manner.

        Obot attacks may explain why so many blogs are going private or closing comments altogether. A regular plague of obots, to which I say (to obots): IF he’s all on the up and up, as you seem to want us to believe, then why do y’all have to spend your lives putting out disinformation and trying to distract people from the TRUTH?


    • Hayden and C.A. Holly

      Thanks for your observations and comments. We need all available eyes and your input is helpful. Do stay to comment often.

      We welcome you!

  37. Haven’t seen this before. Obots must have come up with this explanation that BHO traveled to the East Coast as a teenager in prep for college so he needed an SS # and got it in CT!

    Hawaii refuses subpoena of Obama birth certificate, citing privacy concerns
    Jack Minor • July 20, 2011 Snips

    The Hawaii Department of Health has refused to comply with a subpoena compelling the state to provide access to the original, filed copy of the President’s birth certificate, citing privacy laws. [Of course, they would! Haven’t seen Orly’s explanation yet. ]

    Another supporter said Obama was a teenager traveling to the state on a college prep trip. “I think it’s more likely that Barack Obama may have traveled to the east coast as a teenager, perhaps in connection with some college prep activity for high school age students – that simply isn’t mentioned in his autobiography.” The poster went on to say, “It is common for schools to arrange trips for students to visit east coast colleges (Harvard, Yale, etc.); and students need to have a social security number when they register for the SAT. So, it’s possible that it was participation in some sort of college prep program that lead to the CT tie in of the social security number.”

    Taitz told the Gazette a subpoena was issued to the state’s attorney general and Loretta Fuddy, the current director of the Hawaii department of health. The document ordered Fuddy to produce the “original 1961 typewritten birth certificate #10641 for Barack Obama … issued 08.08.1961, signed by Dr. David Sinclair, Stanley Ann Dunham Obama and registrar Lee, stored in the Health Department of the State of HI from 08081961 until now.”

    The state of Hawaii responded, saying they would not release the information, citing “privacy” concerns. Taitz said the privacy issues should not apply since she is asking for access to a document the President has supposedly already released. She has since filed a motion with the court requesting they compel the government to supply the information.


    • It’s POSSIBLE that the Mother Ship returned to Earth, beamed young Barry aboard, transported him to CT, where he applied for a SS#, and then returned him to Honolulu, beaming him back onto the basketball court at Punahou just in time for him to make an amazing, game-winning, 3-point shot! I believe I read all about it in the Honolulu Advertiser. Or maybe it was the Honolulu Record.

    • That’s really a ridiculous rationalization, when you think about it. First, we don’t even know if Barry TOOK the SAT. Can we see his score, please? Did Occidental require an SAT? Did Columbia if a person was transferring in after two years elsewhere? But what’s ridiculous is the idea that he’d apply for a SS# from what’s supposed to be a CT address. How long did he stay in CT, waiting to receive his card? If he had it sent to Hawaii, then that would be his residence and he’d get a Hawaii number. Harvard, Yale, etc. AREN’T IN CT. Grasping at straws. Willful ignorance. There’s a good phrase for obots. It’s being bandied about now, with regard to Murdoch and accusations that he was willfully ignorant or blind about the “hacking” going on among a few of his 53,000 employees. Obots are willfully blind and ignorant by choice. Every time a shred of evidence seeps from behind the curtain, the very CLOSED, OPAQUE curtain, they invent rationales out of whole cloth. It’s amazing. Where are ALL HIS RECORDS? If he’s for real and really is “transparent”, then where are his records?

      • I thought he applied for it around 1976-77 anyway , so he wasn’t old enough to anything but scoop ice cream. Which is it?

        • Good point. I don’t remember the exact date. It should have been when he was 16 and old enough to vote. But isn’t that a little young for the SAT? Did they use the SAT in Hawaii? As I recall, prep schools would bring in the testers and give the test to all the kids, on site. If he needed the SS# to take the SAT (which we don’t know is true. Maybe now; may not have been true in 1970’s) then he would have got it in HAWAII for that test and also to work at Baskin-Robbins. If he really worked there.

      • Miri, at least “they” are conceding the issuance was in Connecticut.

        a few weeks back “they” were saying it was a typo in that the States first 3 numbers were transposed.

        this latest one deserves a bwahahahahahahaaaaa loser!

  38. Bernie Goldberg uses Wikipedia as his source for the meaning of “natural born citizen”: http://www.bernardgoldberg.com/who-is-a-natural-born-citizen/#comments

    Not only does he disingenuously imply that because “all relevant courts have so far dismissed all lawsuits” challenging Barry’s eligibility, that means he is eligible, Goldberg also writes,

    “Also from Wikipedia: ‘The natural born citizen clause has been mentioned in passing in several decisions of the United States Supreme Court and lower courts, but the Supreme Court has never directly addressed the question of a specific presidential or vice-presidential candidate’s eligibility as a natural born citizen.'”

    Now this is an outright falsehood, as Attorney Leo Donofrio has proven. The case Minor Vs. Happersett, a SCOTUS case, stated that a person of Obama’s status is NOT a natural born citizen. It would behoove Leo Donofrio to edit that Wikipedia article, to CORRECT the record, especially if lamestream media factcheckers are going to rely on it as TRUTH.

    Wait! I see now that the goalpost has been moved. It used to be that obots argued that the SCOTUS never addressed the meaning of natural born citizen. Leo proved that a lie, so NOW they’ve created a new standard, SCOTUS has never ruled on the eligibility of any “specific” candidate. Now I have to go see when that entry was changed. Oh, they’re so sneaky and think they’re so clever. It all depends upon what the meaning of is, is, you see.

    Changed on July 12, 2011 to add that part about the “specific person”. http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Natural-born-citizen_clause_of_the_U.S._Constitution&diff=prev&oldid=439042969

    The modifier argued, “I think it’s important for readers to realize that the question remains open.”

    NOPE. It doesn’t remain open. SUPREME COURT PRECEDENT RULES. OBAMA IS NOT A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN. http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2011/06/21/us-supreme-court-precedent-states-that-obama-is-not-eligible-to-be-president/ Minor vs. Happersett. RULING PRECEDENT.

    This links shows a comparison between an old version and the newest version of WIKI on natural born. It’s interesting to see how they parse.

    NOTICE THAT THE CURRENT VERSION REMOVES HAPPERSETT COMPLETELY. Why’d they remove the relevant case law that was cited for a long time, although probably selectively edited? Here’s where they removed the case history:


    “per talk” means they discussed it and this is their solution to the argument. They only recently decided to do this! Between July 19th and today. WHY is that? Because of the Goldberg article of July 19th that cites their page as “evidence” and was bandied about in the blogsphere since?

    This becomes more interesting as I continue looking into it. They objected to someone citing Leo’s “blog” and removed the reference to it:



    Then, in their “talk”, they said this:

    “Minor v. Happersett Regarding this reverting of material, not only is the source a blog (and not suitable as a reliable source per WP:SPS) [This is their “standards” for sources; laughable, since they cite FactCheck BLOG and “Fight the Smears”, too], but the source misrepresents the context in which Minor v. Happersett discusses the phrase “natural born citizen” — as should be plain if you read the actual text of the opinion (88 U.S. at 167). Richwales (talk · contribs) 06:58, 14 July 2011 (UTC)

    Additionally, anything Minor v. Happersett may say about the meaning of “natural born citizen” is obiter dicta, not a holding, and certainly not a “binding precedent”, because the question of anyone’s eligibility to become President or Vice-President was not even remotely at issue in the case. Richwales (talk · contribs) 07:11, 14 July 2011 (UTC)

    FWIW: This is the latest birther meme (that Minor is controlling law). I expect other IPs to act in a similar manner.[WHAT IS AN IP IN THIS CONTEXT? Any guesses?] –Weazie (talk) 16:48, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
    [edit] “Case law” section — delete?Similarly to the recently deleted “Legislation and executive branch policy” section, it seems to me that an argument can be made for removing the “Case law” section. These court cases deal primarily with questions of citizenship acquired at birth — something which (as the rest of the article makes plain) is not universally accepted as being 100% equivalent to being a “natural born citizen”. Although some of the cases do mention the term “natural born citizen”, they do so in passing; none of these cases (except apparently for Ankeny v. Governor of State of Indiana) dealt directly with the eligibility for the Presidency of a specific individual, so their comments about the natural born citizen clause are at most obiter dicta, not holdings or binding precedents. What do others think? Richwales (talk · contribs) 23:21, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

    I don’t agree with much of your analysis, but I do agree with your ultimate conclusion. (1) The “Case law” section, as is, is WP:OR cherrypicking. (It could be improved by extensively referencing proper sources that discuss those cases, but I don’t see the point in that.) (2) These cases descriptions are lifted from the birthright citizenship articles, which this article links to in the “see also” section — is easy enough for interested readers to find them. –Weazie (talk) 02:05, 16 July 2011 (UTC)”

    BIRTHER! They certainly SOUND like unbiased sources to me! How about you?

    Leo is an “unreliable” source because his is a blog. FactCheck, however, is reliable because why? Because they say so? Leo is an ATTORNEY. What are the tools at FactCheck BLOG?

    Richwales of Wiki is a “computer systems analyst and network security expert.” Sounds qualified to argue law with Leo. NOT!

    obiter dicta means “said in passing,” basically, so this is how they brush off Leo’s argument about precedent.

    Weazie is a “novice editor” at Wiki. Again, sounds qualified to argue law with Leo, don’t you think?

    And they, like Justia, another source they cite, ignore all the cases that USE Minor vs. Happersett when addressing citizenship (Pope vs. Williams and Boyd vs. Nebraska). As Leo explained,

    “This 1892 US Supreme Court Case [Boyd] directly relies upon, and cites as precedent, the citizenship issues discussed by Chief Justice Waite in Minor. Such reliance is further Supreme Court proof that Minor is precedent. Justia appears to be attempting to rewrite history. I have screengrabbed this garbage and so should you. This is wrong, America. They are trying to wipe Minor off the books in order to protect Obama.”

    Go to the Wiki talk link to pickup the links they provide to back up their flimsy arguments.

    Do you find this as fascinating as I do?

    Bernard Goldberg, who purports to be fair and balanced and to factcheck the lamestream media, cites as a source a BIASED entity like Wikipedia.

    Then, when real lawyers and experts weigh in (of course on BLOGS because they cover the news the lamestream won’t), then Wiki reacts by editing out any information people can use to do their own research and make up their own minds.

    “Let’s give them less so it’s harder for them to learn the TRUTH.”

    They’re supposed to provide information but they excise it, so people can’t learn the TRUTH and make up their own minds. These progressives prefer to make up our minds for us!

    See how cleverly they can tie it all up with a bow: Blogs aren’t reliable, so Wiki won’t cite them. Since only blogs cover the truth about Barry’s ineligibility (including blogs written by qualified, licensed attorneys) and lamestream media and publishers won’t cover this issue, therefore, Wiki gives themselves a pass so they don’t HAVE TO COVER it, either.

    Only progressive arguments get into their “unbiased” articles because progressives use Soros money to create their own publishing companies. Voila! Their word is TRUTH and the TRUTH shall be among Wiki readers.

    Academia, also full of progressives, control “academic” publications. Voila! “Reliable sources.”

    Annenberg Foundation (another progressive entity) controls FactCheck and other FREAKING BLOGS. But somehow, their BLOGS are redefined by Wiki as NOT BLOGS, so they’re cited, too.

    btw, what is a BLOG? If Leo simply creates a webpage with his own http, instead of being hosted by WordPress, does that make him a legitimate source for Wiki to cite?

    Oh, now they have me going. I BET YOU that somewhere in all of Wiki, they cite other progressive blogs. What say u? A challenge? Can you find one?

    • Well, that didn’t take long. Wiki has an article about Obama citizenship conspiracy theories. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_citizenship_conspiracy_theories#cite_note-factcheck-5

      Citation number 1. Politifact.

      Citation number 3:

      Michael Tomasky’s BLOG! He’s in the UK! The title of the objective piece, which is OPINION: “Birthers and the persistance of racial paranoia.”

      I know. You can’t make this stuff up.

      Citation number 18: Barry’s Bill Ayers-written biography, which is an interesting choice by itself, since their source policy says that biographies shouldn’t be used if there’s no sourcing for the statements. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:RS


      Citation 25: SNOPES! Enough said.

      Citation 29: Obama for America (HIS CAMPAIGN SITE!)

      Citation 34: Fight the Smears

      Citation number 6: the infamous story from FactCheck BLOG–Born in the USA

      • I had to stop because one of their links crashed my browser. You’ll love this one:

        Citation number 53: The Rachel Maddow BLOG!http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/04/27/6547023-why-obama-shouldnt-have-had-to-show-his-papers-full-version

        Citation 111: Think Progress. Enough said.

        Citation 169: Front Page Magazine BLOG.

        Citation 194: Phil’s The Right Side of Life, which I believe even Phil considers to be a blog.

        Special dishonorable mention is Citation 104 that goes to Huffpo: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/10/james-von-brunn-apparentl_n_214006.html

        An article by Sam Stein that purports to tie Holocaust Museum terrorist/shooter, 88-year-old James Von Brunn to “birthers”. But wait! Where does it say that? That article links to yet another article for “proof” of his “apparent” belief: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/10/james-w-von-brunn-holocau_n_213864.html

        But where does that document his “apparent belief?” Why, here ya go:

        “A man has posted under the name James W. Von Brunn on various online forums, questioning President Barack Obama’s origin of birth. A post under that name was pulled on the day of the shooting from the conservative website Free Republic; a cached version is here.”

        A MAN. How do they know it’s a man? It’s a commenter on anonymous online BLOG forums! You know what else? If you go to those forums, one James Von Brunn is in Cebu, Philippines, and another is in Oslo, Norway. My guess is the world may contain MANY men named James Von Brunn, especially in Norway, and besides, they have NO PROOF whatsoever that the handle this anonymous person uses is his real name. The Free Republic James Von Brunn is also in Norway.

        Is there any proof that the Holocaust suspect was EVER in Cebu or Oslo? If they’re going to BELIEVE that his name is James W. Von Brunn, then they must also logically believe WHERE he says he is located. If he made up his location, why wouldn’t he also make up the name?

        So there’s “evidence” for you. Unbiased? You be the judge. Especially when they have an article DESIGNED to smear “birthers”. It appears they cite blogs ONLY when they can use what’s on the blogs to ridicule or criticize “birthers”.

  39. A poster on the wall at Granny Sarah Obama’s house in Kenya. Hat tip to another extraordinary researcher.

  40. There are two kinds of Natural Born American Citizens

    1. Those that were born to 2 American parents

    2. Those that claim the status even though they weren’t

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